~[Verse Drama] The Ring of the Nibelung by Richard Wagner - rr

Plays and other dramatic works
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BrianFullen
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Post by BrianFullen »

The Ring of the Niblung, by Richard Wagner (d. 1883), translated by Margaret Armour (d. 1943)
An English language dramatic reading of Wagner's Der Ring des Nibelungen (The Ring of the Nibelung) referred to by the composer as a Bühnenfestspie ("stage festival play"). Wagner was both composer and librettist for the epic dramas comprising "the Ring Cycle". His intent was that a prelude, Das Rheingold (The Rhinegold), should be performed of an evening and that the trilogy of Die Walküre (The Valkyrie), Siegfried and Götterdämmerung (Twilight of the Gods) should thence be performed on the three succeeding days. (Summary by Brian Fullen)
Source text (please read only from these texts!):
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/48214 (The Rhinegold & The Valkyrie)
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/49507 (Siegfried & The Twilight of the Gods)

Deadline: Please submit your recording within 2 months of placing your claim. If you cannot complete the recording within this time, please post in the thread to relinquish your claim or to ask the BC for an extension. If your recording is not completed by the deadline, your claim may be reassigned at the BC's discretion.

Claiming roles: Look in the Magic Window below for the list of available roles. Post a reply in this thread asking for the role you would like to record.
Please note: All LibriVox recordings are in the public domain. When you submit your recording, you will be placing your recording in the public domain as well.

New to recording? Please see our Newbie Guide to Recording for further instructions. A quick guide to our required technical settings can be found here. When you post your file, please tell the BC what name you would like to use in our catalog.

Prooflistening level: Special
Prospective PLs, please see the Guide for Proof-listeners.

Please don't download or listen to files belonging to projects in process unless you are the BC or PL. Our servers are not set up to handle the greater volume of traffic. Please wait until the project has been completed. Thanks!

Magic Window:



BC Admin
Genres for the project: Plays/Drama

Keywords that describe the book: operas, libretti, epic music dramas, legendary sagas, germanic heroic legend

========================================

LibriVox recording settings: mono (1 channel), 44100 Hz sample rate, 128 kbps constant bit rate MP3. See the Tech Specs

For individual roles:
Submit one file per book, where book is one of "The Rhinegold", "The Valkyrie", "Siegfried" or "The Twilight of the Gods". At the beginning of the first file, say:
"Character, read by your name."
Leave 3-5 seconds of space between your lines (room noise, not generated silence).

For narration/stage directions:
Leave 0.5 to 1 second of silence at the beginning.

Say:
"The Ring of the Niblung: (Scene or Act) # of Book, by Richard Wagner, translated by Margaret Armour. This is a LibriVox recording. All LibriVox recordings are in the public domain. For more information or to volunteer, please visit librivox.org."
At the end of each file say:
"End of (Scene or Act) #."
If you are recording the final Scene or Act of a book, add:
"End of Book."
If you are recording the final Act (3) of the final book ("The Twilight of the Gods"), add:
"End of The Ring of the Niblung, by Richard Wagner, translated by Margaret Armour."
Leave 5 seconds of silence at the end.

Please note that:
  • Book is one of: "The Rhinegold", "The Valkyrie", "Siegfried" or "The Twilight of the Gods"
  • Scene only applies to "The Rhinegold", a one act play of four scenes; Act applies to the others which all have three acts ("The Twilight of the Gods" has a Prelude beginning its first act.)
Filename:
For individual roles: niblung_role_#.mp3 where # is one of rhinegold, valkyrie, siegfried or twilight. (e.g. niblung_alberich_rhinegold.mp3)
For final files: niblung_##_wagner_128kb.mp3 where ## is the overall scene or act number. (e.g. niblung_03_wagner_128kb.mp3)

Upload to the LibriVox Uploader: https://librivox.org/login/uploader
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MC to select: redrun

Copy and paste the file link generated by the uploader into a new post in this thread along with the file duration (mm:ss). Watch this thread for prooflistening notes.

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask! Just post in this thread.

EDIT (12 OCT 2023):
The proof listening level for this project is Special in that we are seeking consistency - for the benefit of audio book listeners - in the pronunciation of main character and place names. A link to a recorded pronunciation guide is in section one of the magic window; it is intended as an aid to those volunteers not familiar with the proper pronunciation of those names. Thank you.
EDIT (29 OCT 2023):
Intro/Outro wording
Last edited by BrianFullen on February 29th, 2024, 8:01 pm, edited 6 times in total.
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
alanmapstone
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Post by alanmapstone »

Hi Brian
You are a brave man to take on such a massive project :lol:

I have thought about this myself but thought I was rash enough doing Tristan and Isolde. Good Luck

If you want help with the PL I would be happy to do that although I have quite a lot of PL work on at the moment.

I know it is a bit early to be claiming but I would love to read Loge in Das Rheingold.
Alan
the sixth age shifts into the slippered pantaloon with spectacles on nose
BrianFullen
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Post by BrianFullen »

alanmapstone wrote: October 7th, 2023, 11:30 pm Hi Brian
You are a brave man to take on such a massive project :lol:

I have thought about this myself but thought I was rash enough doing Tristan and Isolde. Good Luck

If you want help with the PL I would be happy to do that although I have quite a lot of PL work on at the moment.

I know it is a bit early to be claiming but I would love to read Loge in Das Rheingold.
I hope you don't mind. I do know that you are doing Tristan and Isolde and I was afraid you might think I was stepping on your toes. Perhaps I should have PM'd you first to seek your blessing. Believe it or not, I did start to pull together material for this back when we were working H&G but I didn't think I was ready for this one then. Maybe I'm not now - but I'm going to try because if I don't do that how can I hope to succeed. Also, I wanted to wait until The Letter was done which it is pending last PLOK's. Alan, I hope you know that you could have any part (not already assigned) in anything I'm working as BC. Yes, of course, Loge is yours and that's the least I could do. I just hope we are still friends! Brian

EDIT: I forgot to say that of course you can PL as much of this one as you wish!
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
alanmapstone
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Post by alanmapstone »

Hi Brian
No need to apologise, I don't own this script and you are entitled to run any project you like. I would not take on anything this big anyway, it will take me months to edit Tristan and this is 4 times as long. But I will be happy to help with anything other than editing.

I am a lifelong Wagnerian and have seen the Ring performed several times including once at the Bayreuth Festival in Germany which was an amazing experience. I also have a hardback copy of the book with the Rackam illustrations that this was scanned from.
Alan
the sixth age shifts into the slippered pantaloon with spectacles on nose
BrianFullen
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Joined: March 30th, 2022, 3:20 pm

Post by BrianFullen »

alanmapstone wrote: October 8th, 2023, 12:11 am Hi Brian
No need to apologise, I don't own this script and you are entitled to run any project you like. I would not take on anything this big anyway, it will take me months to edit Tristan and this is 4 times as long. But I will be happy to help with anything other than editing.

I am a lifelong Wagnerian and have seen the Ring performed several times including once at the Bayreuth Festival in Germany which was an amazing experience. I also have a hardback copy of the book with the Rackam illustrations that this was scanned from.
Hi Alan,

You are most kind! I don't wish to impose and I know you are always quite busy so I will understand if you decline this request: would you be willing to [help me] prepare a pronunciation guide for the actors and PL[s]? For book projects using standard PL I don't typically ask for consistency in pronunciation. But for this project I would like to provide guidelines for the pronunciation of key characters, objects and place names. I wouldn't ask for perfect pronunciation but for at least a "best effort" so that audio book listeners might not become confused.

Thank you,
Brian
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
alanmapstone
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Joined: February 15th, 2012, 12:20 pm
Location: Oxford

Post by alanmapstone »

Hi
Happy to help with a pronunciation guide but a German speaker might also be useful. For a project like this it is good to get consistent pronunciation of characters and places as variations on these thing could be confusing for listeners.

The main thing is to get people to pronounce W as V, so VAAG-ner rather than Wag-ner :lol:
Alan
the sixth age shifts into the slippered pantaloon with spectacles on nose
BrianFullen
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Joined: March 30th, 2022, 3:20 pm

Post by BrianFullen »

alanmapstone wrote: October 8th, 2023, 11:48 am Hi
Happy to help with a pronunciation guide but a German speaker might also be useful. For a project like this it is good to get consistent pronunciation of characters and places as variations on these thing could be confusing for listeners.

The main thing is to get people to pronounce W as V, so VAAG-ner rather than Wag-ner :lol:
Good point, of course, on V's and W's. I used to own a "folks vagen" CC although no one in the States says it that way (it tends to be Volkswagon).

I'm actually thinking more about characters, place names, objects (swords e.g.) etc. I do believe we need to honor Wagner insofar as we can; but, at the same time, we have an English language project that we are doing for the presumable benefit of an English speaking audience. And may I be so bold to say, an audience that has its own cultural (even pop cultural for games, etc.) references to Germanic / Nordic mythology.

So what's your opinion on Loge e.g. should it be said so that our volunteers and our eventual audience understand him to be Loki? Or, in the case of the "All Father / Wanderer" ... should the name be rendered more like Odin or, as written, Wotan (from old English transliteration)? These are the matters that I'm interested in gaining some insightful opinions on.

Thanks.

EDIT: of course I'm not trying to slough off work that a BC should do. I do think that ultimately it's my responsibility. I am certainly will to take a day or two to come up with at list culled from the works for the projects which could then be considered by you and others who might take an interest. Right now e.g. I'd tend to say that perhaps low-gee (hard g) or low-key would be acceptable for Loge. What do you think? Also, for Wotan either woe-din or oh-din might suffice, etc.
Last edited by BrianFullen on October 8th, 2023, 12:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
redrun
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Post by redrun »

My own gut feeling here is: the longer the pronunciation list, the less likely it is that readers will remember a given pronunciation from it - or even that they should pause and look it up.

I'd also recommend changing the first post from "Standard" to "Special" PL, if there's going to be more than a very few words or pronunciation rules. That would also be a good place to link to your guide post, once you have one.
Dramatic Finish
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BrianFullen
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Post by BrianFullen »

redrun wrote: October 8th, 2023, 12:14 pm My own gut feeling here is: the longer the pronunciation list, the less likely it is that readers will remember a given pronunciation from it - or even that they should pause and look it up.

I'd also recommend changing the first post from "Standard" to "Special" PL, if there's going to be more than a very few words or pronunciation rules. That would also be a good place to link to your guide post, once you have one.
Excellent input. Thanks.
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
alanmapstone
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Location: Oxford

Post by alanmapstone »

My inclination would be to use the pronunciations used in performances of the opera and in recordings (of which I have several).
So Wotan would be VO-TAN and Loge would be LOW-ga
Alan
the sixth age shifts into the slippered pantaloon with spectacles on nose
BrianFullen
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Post by BrianFullen »

alanmapstone wrote: October 8th, 2023, 12:42 pm My inclination would be to use the pronunciations used in performances of the opera and in recordings (of which I have several).
So Wotan would be VO-TAN and Loge would be LOW-ga
Thank you Alan. I will give it serious consideration. Maybe it would be opera enthusiasts who would listen to this dramatic reading. I'm just not sure about that. I certainly don't wish to slight high culture in any wise but I do think it possible that a project such as this could be an opportunity to introduce this epic to those who might not normally be attracted to opera. But, of course. On the other hand, I do suppose the mythology is widely known and has been treated in literature, film, games etc. So, maybe it's best to target purists. As I say, I will think hard about it.
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
alanmapstone
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Joined: February 15th, 2012, 12:20 pm
Location: Oxford

Post by alanmapstone »

Hi Brian
Could I also add that under LV rules we are not supposed to alter the source text, so for instance changing Loge to Loki or Wotan to Odin would be breaking the rules. :(
Alan
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BrianFullen
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Post by BrianFullen »

alanmapstone wrote: October 8th, 2023, 2:04 pm Hi Brian
Could I also add that under LV rules we are not supposed to alter the source text, so for instance changing Loge to Loki or Wotan to Odin would be breaking the rules. :(
Thanks Alan. I am of course aware of those rules. I also find that when I PL narrators can get creative especially when there is room for that. Would a narrator be within their rights to pronounce Loge as in Theatre loge (with a soft g sound). I suppose not even though that is an acceptable way to pronounce the word. For that matter LV policy recognizes that non-native language speakers sometimes read English, or even German or French text I suppose and with standard PL we make allowances. I think it best to be clear as and when called for rather than encounter these situations at e.g. PL. :)
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
silverquill
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Post by silverquill »

Ah, the thorny issue of pronunciation! :hmm:

I've read for a DR that was very particular about pronunciation of names, esp Italian and French. I had to redo a lot of lines when I got these wrong. There was and extensive pronunciation file produced by native speakers which helped a lot. Even so, I found making French phonemes difficult. So, it also became a judgement call by the PL. The project is still not completed 8 1/2 years later. :shock:

All this to say that it is not "unLibriVoxy" to ask readers to adhere to a set pronunciation for key names and places. It is, in fact, fairly common. Of course all of this should be made clear at the outset.

Even in regular, standard PL projects, I will often ask someone to correct a pronunciation. We just let people think Thames rhymes with James, now can we? :roll: And, when someone finally corrected me on William Cowper, I was grateful. But, I've had my knuckles rapped a few times when commenting on pronunciations, even as suggestions.
~ Larry
BrianFullen
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Post by BrianFullen »

silverquill wrote: October 8th, 2023, 5:08 pm Ah, the thorny issue of pronunciation! :hmm:

I've read for a DR that was very particular about pronunciation of names, esp Italian and French. I had to redo a lot of lines when I got these wrong. There was and extensive pronunciation file produced by native speakers which helped a lot. Even so, I found making French phonemes difficult. So, it also became a judgement call by the PL. The project is still not completed 8 1/2 years later. :shock:

All this to say that it is not "unLibriVoxy" to ask readers to adhere to a set pronunciation for key names and places. It is, in fact, fairly common. Of course all of this should be made clear at the outset.

Even in regular, standard PL projects, I will often ask someone to correct a pronunciation. We just let people think Thames rhymes with James, now can we? :roll: And, when someone finally corrected me on William Cowper, I was grateful. But, I've had my knuckles rapped a few times when commenting on pronunciations, even as suggestions.
Thanks for sharing your insights and experiences, Larry.

About two hours ago I checked the catalog to see if I could find some help there. I do see The Fall of the Nibelungs by "Unknown" but with the same translator, Margaret Armour. I've thought about listening to it through but, honestly, I'm not sure how much help it will provide. I had a peek at the source text and there are of course some characters in common, though not that many, or so it appears to me. And where there is overlap the source text has slightly different English spellings for those than are used in the source texts for this project

I wonder how prevalent the use of the International Phonetic Alphabet or something akin to it was in 1910. I do imagine someone in LV land knows the answer to that. Even if there was a universally recognized standard I suppose that translators and publishers did not necessarily feel bound to use it.

When I've read on projects that included a smattering of German I've done my best to sort it out using e.g. online translators that have enunciation capability. But those things don't always sound the same, one across another, to my ear. Fortunately for me, given that I don't have any German language skill whatsoever, I have not had to deal with this extensively. Just some phrases in Jean-Christophe in Paris and maybe one other project.

I suppose Alan is correct that we should probably trust in Margaret Armour's handling of Wagner's libretto and be done with it. I suppose it will be best effort on the part of our voice actors and PL's. I will still cull the text to try to come up with some reasonable length (not overly long) list of proper names and work with anyone willing to help on the "preferred" pronunciation for those

Best wishes,
Brian
Epic voice actors needed for The Ring Cycle
Mobsters - you don't have to be larcenous, you can pretend - and a heroic young doctor in love needed for Gold-Killer
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