SOLO [Irish] An Sgéaluidhe Gaedhealach by Dúbhglas de h-Íde - tg

[Kitty]

SG32 now ready for PL.

another cool story. And it made me remember that "cat" is "cat" also in Irish one vocabulary item that was easy to remember.

Only one cut needs to be made:

> at 21:37: (p. 486) repeat, one version can be cut: "o'n oidhche sin níor chuireadar aon thrioblóid ar Chaoilte ná ar a athair's a mháthair"

have a good Sunday still

Sonia

[brianeanna]

Thanks for catching that, Sonia!
B

[brianeanna]

Hi, Sonia.

I've made that correction and the file is now ready for Spot PL.
Very busy at work, so might not get round to another recording/upload for several weeks.
Hope all is well with you.

Brian

[Kitty]

I've made that correction and the file is now ready for Spot PL.

yes and Spot PL ok now, thanks

Very busy at work, so might not get round to another recording/upload for several weeks.

there's time, don't worry. As long as you sometimes check in to tell us you are still on to it, there is no pressure in a solo to finish up in a certain time frame.

My own solo is progressing nicely as well, thanks to you. Only 6 sections left to edit, and I am hoping there will not be much Irish left that we haven't discussed already in previous PMs. So maybe I will manage without any more soundfiles from you.

Sonia

[brianeanna]

Hi Sonia,

SG27 now ready for PL. Please note that it has the same title as SG32, but is a substantially different story.

Brianeanna

[Kitty]

SG27 now ready for PL. Please note that it has the same title as SG32, but is a substantially different story.

super, thank you, Brian. Yes indeed, same title, good you pointed it out. But I found the correct story to read along to

only two small notes for your consideration:

> at 8:45: (p. 382) "béidh daoine ag an tseilg as h-uile thír 'san domhan" - I think there is a jump in the audio and a few words are missing, could you check please ?

> at 9:50: (p. 384) "ar Caoilte" - you say "ar se", not sure whether that is the same thing, so I wanted to point it out and I let you decide

Wishing you a good Easter

Sonia

[brianeanna]

Strong likelihood you're right. I was listening on my commute and heard what I hoped was just a playback error, but if you heard one too, it's likely there.
Brianeanna

[brianeanna]

SG27 now ready for spot PL.
brianeanna

n.b.: "ar" and "arsa" are interchangeable. "ar" is an archaic form, and "arsa" is more modern. I tend to slide into "arsa" when I'm not paying attention. I made the correction anyway.

[Kitty]

SG27 now ready for spot PL.

are you sure you uploaded the correct file or to the correct folder ? The file in the MW is still the same two errors. Could you check please ?

Good to have you back

Sonia

[brianeanna]

Hi Sonia,
Try it again now.
Brianeanna

[Kitty]

Try it again now.

yep now I hear it all clearly. PL ok now. Thanks, and enjoy your upcoming weekend

Sonia

[brianeanna]

SG14 now ready for PL.
Brianeanna

[Kitty]

SG14 now ready for PL.

ah another story ready, wonderful. Another pleasant listening and two words triggered an old conversation I had with my Irish teacher back in the university days. Maybe you can clarify today what he couldn't back then:

Both words, "aréir" and "arís", seem to be exceptions (the only ones I could ever detect) of the "slender with slender and broad with broad" rule of Irish orthography.
Is there a historical reason for this, or simply convention or an oversight of the regulating academy ?
Or because the broad 'a' is unstressed and sounds like a slender 'e' anyway ? I think that goes for many words which apply the rule nevertheless.
Or because it's only one single consonant and the rule only applies to double consonants ? Surely other words have only one consonant and apply the rule.

Anyway...back to your story...textually all perfect, only the intro silence needs to be trimmed:

> in the beginning: you have 3 seconds of silence, we recommend 0.5 to 1 maximum, otherwise it's too long for the recording to start

thanks

Sonia

[brianeanna]

I've trimmed the beginning of the file and marked it "Ready for Spot PL".

In fact, there are many words that break the "caol le caol agus leathan le leathan" rule. Most (or all) are composite words, where the first unit ends in a broad consonant and the second unit begins with a slender consonant (and vice versa). So, for example "banríon" (queen), "ilrannach" (many versed), and "forghníomhaigh" (to execute).

The two examples you provide are interesting, in that there is only one consonant separating the units of the composite words. Consider also "aniar" (from the west). My ear tells me that the stressed second syllable imposes its broad or slender quality on the separating consonant, but that the alternative quality is permissible.

"Arís" comes from the Middle Irish "[d]o-fhrithis", and "aréir", probably formed analogically, comes from the (Middle?) Irish "irráir," which is assumed to have come from "ír-fháir" and then become "aréir" by metathesis.

[Kitty]

I've trimmed the beginning of the file and marked it "Ready for Spot PL".

and PL ok

In fact, there are many words that break the "caol le caol agus leathan le leathan" rule.

ok but I only had a very limited vocabulary list back in the days these were the only two I came up with

Most (or all) are composite words, where the first unit ends in a broad consonant and the second unit begins with a slender consonant (and vice versa).

ah yes, maybe for composite words the rule doesn't need to be kept up, as each word could also have been written separately with a space or a dash. So it's not really the same as my examples.

The two examples you provide are interesting, in that there is only one consonant separating the units of the composite words. Consider also "aniar" (from the west). My ear tells me that the stressed second syllable imposes its broad or slender quality on the separating consonant, but that the alternative quality is permissible.

ok I see...so would you have read it differently if the rule was applied and the words were spelt: ainiar, airís and airéir ? My question was, why did the academy opt to not apply the rule in those words ?

We will probably never know.

"Arís" comes from the Middle Irish "[d]o-fhrithis", and "aréir", probably formed analogically, comes from the (Middle?) Irish "irráir," which is assumed to have come from "ír-fháir" and then become "aréir" by metathesis.

I see so originally those words also were composites. Yes that could be a reason. Thanks for taking the time to discuss this with me. I'm fascinated by linguistics, as you may have guessed by now.

Sonia