Covermakers Chat Thread

[msfry]

I like the idea. While it would require a bit of a change on our end, I don't think it would be earth-movingly difficult to implement.

Perhaps we could make the _itemimage 600x600, keeping the rest the current sizes. That way, (1) the display image on Archive is larger; (2) it's easy to harvest for other purposes; (3) there are still only 3 image files.

During the transition, I think a reminder to cover-makers that we're changing the size is warranted, but we don't have to reject files if they're the old size.

I am about to upload a cover. I will include the 600x600 in the zip file. Give it a try.

[TriciaG]

I find it surprising that the 600x600 "itemimage" isn't the main image shown on the Archive page. Instead, it's the 300x300 one.

Anne can chime in on this, but I'm pretty sure the main image (without underscores) needs to be 300x300 for such things as iTunes, so we can't mess with that one. But why does Archive have an "item image" if they don't use it on their page?

[msfry]

I find it surprising that the 600x600 "itemimage" isn't the main image shown on the Archive page. Instead, it's the 300x300 one.

Anne can chime in on this, but I'm pretty sure the main image (without underscores) needs to be 300x300 for such things as iTunes, so we can't mess with that one. But why does Archive have an "item image" if they don't use it on their page?

Well, I'll be darned! iTunes is displaying our covers now. When I was researching it a few years back, they were requiring something like 1280 x 1280 images, and I haven't checked back since then. Maybe they can accommodate a larger than 300 x 300 image, too.

[msfry]

Thanks for uploading the Fires cover. When I checked the Archive page, it began by displaying the 600 x 600 image in the middle of the page, then it disappeared and the 300 x 300 image showed up when it displayed the chapters. Click on the See More arrow, and two sizes of cover show up, 300 and 150. Before, two 150's showed up.

[TriciaG]

Yes, the page displays the *.jpg file (300), and the "see more" actually has the 300 and 600 images (*.jpg and *_itemimage.jpg). But when you click on the See More, they are reducing the size shown. Here's the code for that "see more" page:

Code: Select all

<div class="BRpagecontainer pagediv0 BRpageloading BRpage-visible" style="position: absolute; width: 180px; height: 180px; top: 0px; left: 0px; transform: translate(615px, 24px);" data-side="R">
  <img class="BRpageimage" alt="Book page image" src="https://archive.org/download/sketchofgreatfires_2401_librivo_eatfireswisconsin 2401.jpg?scale=1&rotate=0&scale=1& rotate=0" style="background: url("/bookreader/BookReader/images/loading.gif") center center / 20px no-repeat;"> 
</div> 
<!----> 
<!----> 
<div class="BRpagecontainer pagediv0 BRpageloading BRpage-visible" style="position: absolute; width: 360px; height: 360px; top: 0px; left: 0px; transform: translate(525px, 228px);" data-side="L"> 
  <img class="BRpageimage" alt="Book page image" src="https://archive.org/download/sketchofgreatfires_2401_librivo_sconsin_2401_itemimage.jpg?scale=1&rotate=0&scale=1& rotate=0" style="background: url("/bookreader/BookReader/images/loading.gif") center center / 20px no-repeat;">
</div> 
<!----> 

They reduce the *.jpg to 180x180 and the *_itemimage.jpg to 360x360. But if you download them, they're full size.

It just surprises me that they don't display the "itemimage". I wonder what it's used for, if not for display.

Or maybe that's what they use when there are no audio files, as you say - then when that player pops up, they revert to the *.jpg (300) file.

[msfry]

And then there are the thumbnails on the IA Librivox Collection pages. What size are they? (I don't know how to get to the source code.)

[TriciaG]

It's 180x180, but I can't tell which image they use for it - whether the *.jpg or the *_itemimage.jpg.

[msfry]

It's 180x180, but I can't tell which image they use for it - whether the *.jpg or the *_itemimage.jpg.

I just checked that out and concluded the bottom image behind "see more" is _itemimage, because when you right click "open in a new tab" on Fires of Wisconsin, it displays the 600x600 jpg. In fact, if you click "save as" on any image, it will show you the file name of that image. On an previous book I did the cover on, the second image displays the 300x300 _itemimage.

So where does the thumbnail actually get used? On the Collections page, those thumbnails are renamed by IA like so: sketchofgreatfires_2401_librivox.jpg

[TriciaG]

So where does the thumbnail actually get used?

I'm pretty certain it's in OUR catalog.

I just checked that out and concluded the bottom image behind "see more" is _itemimage, because when you right click "open in a new tab" on Fires of Wisconsin, it displays the 600x600 jpg. In fact, if you click "save as" on any image, it will show you the file name of that image. On an previous book I did the cover on, the second image displays the 300x300 _itemimage.

Yes. But you were asking about the pages on Archive that show multiple projects, like this one: https://archive.org/details/librivoxaudio?sort=-date

That one, the "open in new tab" trick doesn't work, because they pull the image in some other way (such as https://archive.org/services/img/menofiron_2401_librivox). Those are 180x180.

[annise]

Archive no longer needs the _item image, they changed some time ago. Anne

[msfry]

Archive no longer needs the _item image, they changed some time ago. Anne

They may not "need" it, but they do use it. Here is how IA displays our files:
Main page: title_date.jpg
See more, top picture: title_date.jpg
bottom picture: title_date_itemimage.jpg

If we were to size itemimage at 600x600, it would give BengtW a file to download sized just right for YouTube. That problem would be resolved.

I do not see where IA uses our title_date_thumb.jpg anywhere. IA creates its own filename for the thumbnails they display, and they are not even .jpgs, but imbedded in htm documents.

Here is how LibriVox uses our files:
Catalog Page: title_date.jpg
Download Cover Art: title_date.jpg
Home Page and Search Results: title_date_thumb.jpg

I don't see where LV uses our itemimage anywhere.

html programs can size objects however they want regardless of original file size. Larger files sized down are sharper than small files sized up, which as we know lose quality.

[TriciaG]

We use the thumb on the home page and other project listings (recent releases, search results).

If Archive doesn't really utilize it anywhere (yes, they "use" it by putting it in "see more", but only because we've uploaded it), I can't see why we can't make them 600x600 as we have experimentally on the Wisconsin wildfire project.

Anne, what say you? Other than checking they're the right size, is there any more consideration on your end as main cover-uploader?

[msfry]

We use the thumb on the home page and other project listings (recent releases, search results).

Yes, I just realized that and added it in above, in red.

[annise]

I did not say IA didn't show the itemimage file, I said they no longer needed it. If you remember the change they made to accept files that did not show gave results that Michele didn't like because it showed both images in the same space.
And so they changed it to the current system.
Just fyi
changing an image from 300X300 to 600X600 multiples the size by 4 so to say it doesn't cost anything may be incorrect . If I had to choose what I used my storage for between audiobooks and your or my covers, I know what I would choose.

Anne

[msfry]

I did not say IA didn't show the itemimage file, I said they no longer needed it. If you remember the change they made to accept files that did not show gave results that Michele didn't like because it showed both images in the same space.
And so they changed it to the current system.
Just fyi
changing an image from 300X300 to 600X600 multiples the size by 4 so to say it doesn't cost anything may be incorrect . If I had to choose what I used my storage for between audiobooks and your or my covers, I know what I would choose.

Anne

I don't recall any discussion around IA changing to a new system re our covers, except re the "see more" arrow moved off the upper right corner of the cover, and the changing background colors. I won the first, lost the second. If they changed the cover display behind the arrow, that's good as it gives us an opportunity to improve, but what I had to do with that I don't remember.

Our images are stored on IA, right? Wherever they are, storage costs are so negligible nowadays, if IA allows it, why shouldn't we? I donate to them annually, so I don't feel bad about using a tiny fragment more of their storage space. And if stored on LV, I'll gladly donate to purchase us more server space if we can't afford it.