[HISTORY - LAWS] Tribal Custom in Anglo-Saxon Law by Frederic Seebohm - jo

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Freso
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Post by Freso »

I might be up for applying my Danish accent to “DANISH VIEW OF ANGLO-SAXON CUSTOM.” (and possibly also for “FROM THE VIKING OR NORTHMEN’S POINT OF VIEW”).

The sections in Latin/Old Norse/etc. that has an English translation next to it, should the original text be read too, or is it enough with the translated English text? Should anything special be done with the "margin" notes or should they just be ignored (some of them sound like descriptions of illustrations, but I don’t see any associated with them)?

Also, Roman numerals are sometimes "translated" to English words and sometimes not and sometimes it’s not really obvious to me what they mean/imply. E.g.,
[…] leger-stow þeah sig mid lx scill. and feald cyricean þær leger-scow ne sig mid xxx scyll.
[…] provided there be a burying place, lx scillings and of a field church thirty scillings.
"lx" is not "translated" but "xxx" is. Should "lx" still be read as "lx" or should it be "sixty"? (Also, should "scillings" be pronounced like modern-day English with a "sh" or like modern-day Danish "sk"?)
progressingamerica
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Post by progressingamerica »

Freso wrote: January 6th, 2024, 4:43 am I might be up for applying my Danish accent to “DANISH VIEW OF ANGLO-SAXON CUSTOM.” (and possibly also for “FROM THE VIKING OR NORTHMEN’S POINT OF VIEW”).

The sections in Latin/Old Norse/etc. that has an English translation next to it, should the original text be read too, or is it enough with the translated English text? Should anything special be done with the "margin" notes or should they just be ignored (some of them sound like descriptions of illustrations, but I don’t see any associated with them)?

Also, Roman numerals are sometimes "translated" to English words and sometimes not and sometimes it’s not really obvious to me what they mean/imply. E.g.,
[…] leger-stow þeah sig mid lx scill. and feald cyricean þær leger-scow ne sig mid xxx scyll.
[…] provided there be a burying place, lx scillings and of a field church thirty scillings.
"lx" is not "translated" but "xxx" is. Should "lx" still be read as "lx" or should it be "sixty"? (Also, should "scillings" be pronounced like modern-day English with a "sh" or like modern-day Danish "sk"?)
I would be more in favor of saying "sixty" instead of "ell ex". An audio book consumer listening in English probably won't know, and even moreso probably won't care that the number is in a romantic style. The number is a number. Now if we were talking about a book written in Latin instead of English, there might be more toward the other way.

As for scillings, that is a tough one. I don't think either one is necessarily wrong as you present the choice. In what little information I was able to discover in 5 minutes of searching (so this is probably incorrect) the Danes hail from Jutland, meaning they are outsiders looking at what the Saxons and what Anglia to their south were up to.(Or the Anglo-Saxon Britons across the water) - and I also have not read the chapter/sections either. It does seem that based on the wording of the choice, "sk" is perhaps more accurate. Hopefully someone else with more knowledge will chime in with greater detail.

Also, the prooflistening level is at standard. What that means is just do your best to be as accurate as possible, but razor sharp exactness is not required. So what will an audio book consuming audience do with regards to ease of listening? If you say "sh" as in "shilling", well that is money isn't it? Would that lead to reader confusion since the short sentence you presented doesn't seem to lean toward the economic? Just a random thought, but that also builds the case for "sk".
MrsHand
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Post by MrsHand »

Could I have a couple extra weeks to finish my sections, please?
progressingamerica
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Post by progressingamerica »

MrsHand wrote: January 21st, 2024, 5:14 pm Could I have a couple extra weeks to finish my sections, please?
Of course, thank you for checking in.
Cbteddy
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Post by Cbteddy »

May I have section 27?
Cheers,
Claire

~~Books are like people, but usually more interesting~~
~~I'm not addicted to reading. I can stop as soon as I finish the next chapter~~

Come read!
The Boys' Book of Famous Rulers by Lydia Hoyt Farmer
progressingamerica
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Post by progressingamerica »

Cbteddy wrote: February 17th, 2024, 12:20 pm May I have section 27?
Ready to go.
Blodwyn
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Post by Blodwyn »

Cbteddy wrote: November 14th, 2023, 6:33 pm Hello! Here is Chapter 24 (32:02). I found this chapter VERY tough, and did my best with the Latin, Norman French, and Scottish English passages.

https://librivox.org/uploads/knotyouraveragejo/tribalcustom_24_seebohm_128kb.mp3
Sorry for the delay, it's been a busy Christmas and New Year (I can't believe it's nearly March already!)
I've listened through Tribalcustom_24_seebohm_128kb.mp3 and have to say, you did a great job with what seemed like a very difficult chapter! All of the things I picked up were the same as in section 23, i.e. d for pennies and the pronunciation of Cymric.

---

8:03 - “Thane’s grandson or ogthiern 44 cows & 21d. and ⅔d.” - You’ve said dramen for the d here, however I believe that the d is representative of pennies.

20:30 - “Son of comes and thane 44 ” and 21 d. and ⅔ ob.” - You’ve said drachma here however (as above) the d stands for pennies and the ob is halfpennies.

20:35 - “Son of thane 29 ” ” 11 d. ” ⅓ ” “ - As above, and you missed out the ⅓ halfpennies when reading.

22:40 - “...but also in gold value, like that of the Cymric codes and so many others, …” - Pronunciation of Cymric, should be CUM-ric rather than SIM-ric
22:59 - “It is the same as the Welsh galanas of the uchelwr, and the use in the laws of Cymric and Gaelic words might…”
- Pronunciation of Cymric, should be CUM-ric rather than SIM-ric
23:23 - “The galanas of the Welsh uchelwr was 120 cows. Moreover, the cows in which the Welsh galanas was paid were equated with three scores of silver, i.e. three Saxon ounces of 20d., while the cows in which the cro was paid were equated with three ores of 16d.” - You’ve said drachma here however (as above) the d stands for pennies

25:47 - “But it was a payment which, like the Cymric saraad…” - Pronunciation of Cymric, should be CUM-ric rather than SIM-ric

28:22 - “They closely resemble in principle Cymric usage and are, after all, what the study of Beowulf…” - Pronunciation of Cymric, should be CUM-ric rather than SIM-ric

28:52 - “Strongly influenced as custom in Scotland must have been by both Cymric and Gaelic…” - Pronunciation of Cymric, should be CUM-ric rather than SIM-ric
Cbteddy
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Post by Cbteddy »

Hello! Here is section 27 (29:21). I attempted to translate the sections written in non-English, however Google translate seemed to be stumped. I tried copy/pasting individual words, whole phrases and even a whole paragraph, but Google couldn't really decide what language it was.

I did include the English translation. I'm happy to add in the original language if someone could help me out on what it may actually be and how to pronounce it.

https://librivox.org/uploads/knotyouraveragejo/tribalcustom_27_seebohm_128kb.mp3
Cheers,
Claire

~~Books are like people, but usually more interesting~~
~~I'm not addicted to reading. I can stop as soon as I finish the next chapter~~

Come read!
The Boys' Book of Famous Rulers by Lydia Hoyt Farmer
knotyouraveragejo
LibriVox Admin Team
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Post by knotyouraveragejo »

We don't include translations in our recordings that are not in the text itself. Please do not include a translation that was not part of the original text. You need to read the original as written, non-English languages and all. You can ask for pronunciation help or for someone to record the non-English parts for you and then paste their reading into your recording -

Pronunciation help: all languages: viewtopic.php?t=40285
Jo
Cbteddy
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Post by Cbteddy »

knotyouraveragejo wrote: February 25th, 2024, 6:09 pm We don't include translations in our recordings that are not in the text itself. Please do not include a translation that was not part of the original text. You need to read the original as written, non-English languages and all. You can ask for pronunciation help or for someone to record the non-English parts for you and then paste their reading into your recording -

Pronunciation help: all languages: viewtopic.php?t=40285
Hi Jo! Thanks for the clarification, but I don't believe I explained myself clearly initially. The text includes sections that have the original language, as well as the English translation (essentially side by side). I've read the English language as it's in the text, and usually I can copy/paste the other language into google translate so I can click the speaker icon to get an idea of the correct pronunciation for the foreign language. In this case, Google couldn't recognize the language, and there's not a clear indication in the text that I could find either.

I'll definitely post for help in the forum thread and will keep my fingers crossed that someone can help!

Thanks for your patience and help! :)
Cheers,
Claire

~~Books are like people, but usually more interesting~~
~~I'm not addicted to reading. I can stop as soon as I finish the next chapter~~

Come read!
The Boys' Book of Famous Rulers by Lydia Hoyt Farmer
progressingamerica
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Post by progressingamerica »

Cbteddy
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Post by Cbteddy »

Hello! Here are the updates for section 24. New run time is 32:04.

https://librivox.org/uploads/knotyouraveragejo/tribalcustom_24_seebohm_128kb.mp3

Still working on the old English bits for section 27, but hoping to have that done in the next day or two.

Please note that section 23 was re-uploaded with edits back in December. I'm not sure if there's anything pending from me for that file?

Thanks!
Cheers,
Claire

~~Books are like people, but usually more interesting~~
~~I'm not addicted to reading. I can stop as soon as I finish the next chapter~~

Come read!
The Boys' Book of Famous Rulers by Lydia Hoyt Farmer
progressingamerica
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Joined: November 29th, 2010, 3:50 pm

Post by progressingamerica »

Cbteddy wrote: April 15th, 2024, 5:16 pm Hello! Here are the updates for section 24. New run time is 32:04.

https://librivox.org/uploads/knotyouraveragejo/tribalcustom_24_seebohm_128kb.mp3
Updated the MW for 23 and 24.
Cbteddy
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Joined: September 16th, 2023, 7:26 pm
Location: Somewhere out there

Post by Cbteddy »

Hello! Here is section 27. I did my best with the Old English pronunciations, and am happy to adjust anything as needed. Run time is 44:37.

https://librivox.org/uploads/knotyouraveragejo/tribalcustom_27_seebohm_128kb.mp3
Cheers,
Claire

~~Books are like people, but usually more interesting~~
~~I'm not addicted to reading. I can stop as soon as I finish the next chapter~~

Come read!
The Boys' Book of Famous Rulers by Lydia Hoyt Farmer
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