Deadlines

[msfry]

It's frustrating when readers hold up a project without checking in and the BC sits around waiting 2 months for a finished file. Also frustrating to see new readers claiming sections on many projects at a time, like a kid in a candy store. Somewhere I think we caution readers not to take on too much at once, and ask them to check in periodically, but I'd like to see those instructions prominently featured in the First Post, on every group project. Also, I'd like to see expectations prominently set for how long it might take the DPL to proof a file (3 days seems an eternity to me) and for the reader to fix errors. I recommend these be added into the template generator, something like these bits in bold:

Deadline: Please submit your recording within 2 months of placing your claim. If you cannot complete the recording within this time, please post in the thread to relinquish your claim or to ask the BC for an extension. Please don't sign up for more than you can handle timely, and please check in every few weeks to let the BC know you're still on board to complete your assignment(s). If your recording is not completed by the deadline, your claim may be reassigned at the BC's discretion.

Prooflistening level: Standard
Prospective PLs, please see the Guide for Proof-listeners. DPL's should be able to proof files within 5 days, and readers should make any corrections shortly thereafter. Files uncorrected by cataloging time may be salvaged by the BC (if possible), or the file may be deleted and a new reader assigned.

[Penumbra]

DPL's should be able to proof files within 5 days

This seems reasonable under normal circumstances, but not if the DPL is on vacation or is experiencing an emergency or life has otherwise gotten in the way. I recently lost power for three days and I know some who have been without power for two weeks.

I wonder if this is a widespread problem or is confined to a small number of volunteers. Has anyone collected statistics on this?

[DACSoft]

Re: Recordings:

While I agree the current verbiage that a reader should meet the 2 months requirement for submission, or request an extension (collaboratives), or just an update for solos, continually updating every 2 or 3 weeks seems to exceed LV expections for the volunteer work being done.

******

Re: DPL/PL

There can many legitimate reasons why a recording cannot be DPLed/PLed within a week of submission, as we are all volunteers with limited or unexpected factors with competing priorities and RL. My suggestion, which may be a good compromise, is that DPLs/PLs submit a post if they cannot complete the listening within a week.

******

Of course, at least according to my understanding, a BC can override the LV requirements, if necessary, to tighten up the time periods. Then readers and listeners can elect to volunteer for the project, or look elsewhere.

FWIW,

[msfry]

DPL's should be able to proof files within 5 days

This seems reasonable under normal circumstances, but not if the DPL is on vacation or is experiencing an emergency or life has otherwise gotten in the way. I recently lost power for three days and I know some who have been without power for two weeks.

I wonder if this is a widespread problem or is confined to a small number of volunteers. Has anyone collected statistics on this?

Agreed. DPL's should NORMALLY be able to proof your files within 5 days, or let you know of a delay. The point is to set reasonable expectations for both reader and DPL, not an unbreakable rule. I am convinced some readers are not sure about this. Communication is key.

[msfry]

Re: Recordings:

While I agree the current verbiage that a reader should meet the 2 months requirement for submission, or request an extension (collaboratives), or just an update for solos, continually updating every 2 or 3 weeks seems to exceed LV expections for the volunteer work being done.

My life tends to fill up with new things as soon as a vacuum occurs. It's best for me to stay focused and in touch, and see things through. Gentle reminders, not nagging ones, help me along.

There can many legitimate reasons why a recording cannot be DPLed/PLed within a week of submission, as we are all volunteers with limited or unexpected factors with competing priorities and RL. My suggestion, which may be a good compromise, is that DPLs/PLs submit a post if they cannot complete the listening within a week.

Exactly. Submit a post if you can't fulfill the requested deadline. Part of being on a team is staying in touch. If the BC needs a file PL'd sooner, they can do it themselves or tap someone to do it. I've seen this occur mostly toward the end of a project when the push to get it finished is on and the DPL is out of pocket for awhile. No problem.

Of course, at least according to my understanding, a BC can override the LV requirements, if necessary, to tighten up the time periods. Then readers and listeners can elect to volunteer for the project, or look elsewhere.

I've seen BC's contact readers and ask them to hurry it up so the project can wrap up, and the results are always good! The cattle prod works!

[DACSoft]

Of course, at least according to my understanding, a BC can override the LV requirements, if necessary, to tighten up the time periods. Then readers and listeners can elect to volunteer for the project, or look elsewhere.

I've seen BC's contact readers and ask them to hurry it up so the project can wrap up, and the results are always good! The cattle prod works!

For some. For others (like me ), applying a cattle prod usually elicits the opposite response, especially if tighter deadlines are not declared in the opening post. I know what I can handle, then select my workload appropriately. If delays occur, I communicate them to the project. In my particular case, prodding posts usually cause an (internal) adverse reaction.

FWIW,

[annise]

We are working with volunteers, who all have real lives. And things happen.
If we make unreasonable demands, people who realise that will not volunteer for that project - and those that don't realise will, probably claim multiple sections and always will be "doing it this week"

As for DPLs - they have no way of judging how much they will need to do a day unless perhaps it is a soloist they have worked with before.
And really - it is nice for the BC to get a project catalogued but the world will not come to an end if it is a few days later.

Anne

[ej400]

My honest opinion is that if the BC wants to make a project go quicker, they could A. Read it as a solo at their own pace, or B. State that the deadline is sooner than the 2 months.

Being a DPL is unpredictable. You know you could have claims fill in, and files come in faster than you could say the librivox intro. For myself, I would like to know how my section is within a week, but if it takes two weeks, or even longer, I'm okay with that. It's always an option for me to record in more than one project.

Elijah

[lorda]

PL cannot be calculated. Sometimes I have nothing to do in this area for days, then suddenly 6 sections come in a few hours (each longer than 30 minutes) and some projects to be cataloged.

The only way to ensure a fast processing would be for me - to PL less projects or to do less in other areas (MC, BC or reader).

Greetings, Bernd

[annise]

Just in case everyone is not aware - there are deadlines for weekly and fortnightly poetry and for Christmas collections and anniversary ones and other one-up special-purpose collections

Anne

[Availle]

I'm with Don here:

For others (like me ), applying a cattle prod usually elicits the opposite response... […] In my particular case, prodding posts usually cause an (internal) adverse reaction.

Constant nagging of the "are you done yet" kind will get you nowhere any faster. I am aware of my deadlines, and I try to adhere to them as much as possible, keeping the status of the project in mind. Of course, if the project filled up faster than anticipated, and my section is the only one left to complete it, do send me a pm. I'll see what I can do, but no promises.

As was said above, if the BC is hell-bent on bringing a project to catalog before date X, they're better off reading it solo. Things happen all the time (e.g., my voice was just out of order for 4 weeks and only now I get back into the groove), and forcing people to adhere to somebody else's schedule is not a good way to make this a friendly place to volunteer.

As for PLing, yes, it would be nice to have it done within a week or two, but again, things happen. In this case, there is a certain unpredictability of the work load on top of that. If the BC is unsatisfied with the speed, again, PLing themselves is an option.

Overall, I do understand where you're coming from, Michele. It's nice to get things done! And it can get frustrating when projects drag on forever, especially if they're officially fully subscribed. But we're all different personalities here, there's no "one size fits all", and we're all trying to do our best here. I think if people communicate their expectations early enough, there's less room for frustration in the long run.

[stepheather]

FWIW, I think it might be helpful to communicate the general deadline guideline for the DPL. I’ve been doing PL work for a few months, and I still feel apprehensive about it, mostly because I don’t know what’s reasonable.

Obviously it would be only a guideline, but might help prospective PL volunteers to sign up for DPL work—just knowing the expectation of the specific BC.

Posting in the thread definitely helps, but knowing up front…well, we do it for recorders but not PLers.

Please forgive any typos or redundancies. The car is moving now.

Stephanie

[quartertone]

I think a little gentle nudge might make sense if the deadline is approaching (within 1-2 weeks perhaps), especially if the reader has not been active in the forums since being assigned the section.

Some people might incorrectly equate "voluntary" with "not a real commitment".

[silverquill]

Michele,
I share your frustrations!

I BC a lot of group projects, and having it hung up by someone who makes a claim and then doesn't login to LV again is aggravating. I just had to orphan four sections in a project for this very reason after holding out for two months. For orphans, it is not uncommon for a BC to ask for a quick turn around for them.

I often send politely worded notices to readers if their claim is soon expiring, just as a reminder. Of course. if they don't login to LV they never see them anyway. I hate to delete a claim without at least trying to contact them. I've never had anybody push back on these notices. Sometimes they are thankful for a reminder. I've received a few myself when something slipped by me. And, I will also send a note if a reader has the last section just to see if they can help complete the project, but always make sure to assure them that they certainly have more time if they need it. It's all about being polite and considerate and never demanding. Oh, and putting in the claim date, or expiration date in the Notes is helpful, although I usually don't do this until the project is nearing completion and it looks as if there might be some holdouts.

I do, occasionally change the expiration date in the initial post -- in bold red -- to one month for projects with really short sections.

PL -- For my BC projects, I do expect prompt PL, certainly within a week at the most. If the DPL is having issues, I may jump in to move things along. It is the BC's responsibility to keep the project moving. Occasionally I've had to replace a DPL. I also do a lot of DPL work, and, as others have commented, it is often a feast-or-famine affair. If it looks as if I may be delayed on DPL, I try to post a note to that project so people know they are not being ignored or that I have missed something. And, I don't mind being reminded if I do. Can anyone say patience?

Whether changing the template, Michele, would make a difference, I don't know.
A BC can always add extra wording to the instructions, of course.

They key is to treat everyone with respect and grace, and with gratitude for their volunteer time and contributions.

[msfry]

Thanks for those comments, Larry. You have much experience handling BC and DPL issues, and an excellent track record for getting things done. I think BC's should be treated more respectfully, for without them putting in the hours to create our projects, where would Librivox be? But then, how would newbies know that until they've BC'd some projects of their own. And how do PL'ers know what it's like to wait and wait for your PL OK's before you take on more sections, especially if they don't read themselves. Lots to consider, everyone plays a part, and it's teamwork all along the way.

Okay, so "cattle prod" was probably not the right word. And nagging, not right either. Nudging, reminding, guiding are much better words, and tools the BC should feel free to use to keep their projects moving. And of course none of these need be applied to people who post when they are going to be absent for awhile, who haven't disappeared, who know the way LV works, and are enthusiastic participants.