[OPEN]Multilingual Short Works Collection 025 - Poetry & Prose - thw

Deutsche Projekte, Nederlandstalige Projecten, Proyectos en español, projets en français, Projekty po polsku, 日本語のプロジェクト
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Guomin
Posts: 36
Joined: June 20th, 2020, 11:30 am

Post by Guomin » June 24th, 2020, 1:18 pm

Hello, I did another recording at 00:50.
Link here: https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_shuxiang_du_gx_128kb.mp3

I decided to do it in my home dialect(Southwestern Mandarin, Chengdu dialect) because the poem is about a great person who once lived in the area, and the poet also lived there. But for authenticity, I searched up some stuff on the net and tried to recreate older versions of Chengdu dialect, which has evolved rapidly over the past century, so this is quite a bit different from the dialect actually spoken in Chengdu nowadays...... Apologize beforehand to any PLs out there :oops:

The title is shu xiang(third tone on shu and fourth tone on xiang) or 蜀相, the characters are the same in simplified and traditional. The author is 杜甫, du fu (fourth tone on du and third tone on fu). I think there isn't an official romanization system for my dialect as of now, so I will stick with pinyin.

Source:http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/52323/pg52323-images.html
Do I need to provide any information other than that?

Thank you for your work!
Guomin

Liber
Posts: 71
Joined: May 26th, 2020, 5:50 am

Post by Liber » June 24th, 2020, 2:22 pm

With Catullus CI always goes Foscolo's sonnet.

The year is on page 10: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n9/mode/2up , and 531: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n531/mode/2up ; but not anomalies at page 533: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n533/mode/2up . Probably it was a copy of the 1825 republished later, in the '40s. There was a price in Italy and one in Austria!!!

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

In morte del fratello Giovanni di Ugo Foscolo (1778–1827)
Text URL: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n383/mode/2up?q=fratel
Duration: 1:26
MP3 URL: https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_mortefratello_foscolo_le_128kb.mp3
Link to author on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ugo_Foscolo
Key Words: multilingual, italian, catullus, foscolo, poetry, sonnet, death, grief, burial, funeral rites, exile
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Thank you for your time.
Liber

Liber
Posts: 71
Joined: May 26th, 2020, 5:50 am

Post by Liber » June 24th, 2020, 2:24 pm

Liber wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 2:22 pm
The year is on page 10: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n9/mode/2up , and 531: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n531/mode/2up ; but not anomalies at page 533: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n533/mode/2up . Probably it was a copy of the 1825 republished later, in the '40s. There was a price in Italy and one in Austria!!!
The year is on page 10: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n9/mode/2up , and 531: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n531/mode/2up ; but note anomalies at page 533: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n533/mode/2up .

Probably it was a copy of the 1825 republished later, in the '40s. There was a price in Italy and one in Austria!!!

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 3:19 pm

Guomin wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 9:11 am
I got the corrected one in!

https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_shudaonan_li_gx_128kb.mp3

Time:02:29
Thank you, Guomin! I've updated the MW.
Just another question, if I want to solo some short works in Mandarin, where should I go and post?
I see that you've already figured out how to start a solo project. :) It looks like the text you picked is about 12 printed pages. I'm not good at estimating recording length for Chinese text, but I would guess that it will be under 72 minutes, which means that we could include it in this collection instead. If we include it in this collection, it won't be broken into multiple sections, but you won't have to worry about filling out the Magic Window yourself, and a Meta-Coordinator won't have to worry about cataloging a separate project. Just so you're aware of the pros and cons.

Michael

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 3:31 pm

Piotrek81 wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 10:27 am
I'm back 8-)

Here's something short, yet well-known in Poland, i.e one of the Sonnets from Crimea (Sonety Krymskie), written by a famous poet, Adam Mickiewicz, as he was traversing Crimea. This particular sonnet deals with the transience of human power as evidenced by the fate of the former rulers who once inhabited the complex of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakhchisaray_Palace
Back in 2012 I recorded a bilingual version of the whole cycle, toegether with Algy Pug. Here's a new version of one poem, hopefully of a better quality than the previous recording.

https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_bakczysaraj_mickiewicz_pn81_128kb.mp3
duration: 1:04
Author: Adam Mickiewicz (1798-1855)
Source: https://pl.wikisource.org/wiki/Poezye_Adama_Mickiewicza._T._1._(1899) (for the whole collection the piece was taken from) https://pl.wikisource.org/wiki/Bakczysaraj_(Mickiewicz,_1899) (for the particular poem)
key words: podróź, historia, przyroda, przemijanie, poezja, sonet
Author on Wikipedia: https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Mickiewicz
Welcome back, Piotrek! :) Ah, I wish I knew Polish... I've heard great things about Polish poetry, both classic and modern.

The source is PD. It's one of those Wikisource editions that are accompanied by scans. I found the page that has a scan of the poem for the MW.

Michael

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 3:36 pm

Liber wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 11:16 am
Obviously, there is much to improve :-) Sbagliando si impara (hopefully) :-)
I find that working to improve my reading and speaking in general is one of my favorite things about LV, but I can't claim to be as much of a perfectionist as you seem to be! :D
MW updated. I'm assuming the length is unchanged?

Michael

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 3:51 pm

Guomin wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 1:18 pm
Hello, I did another recording at 00:50.
Link here: https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_shuxiang_du_gx_128kb.mp3

I decided to do it in my home dialect(Southwestern Mandarin, Chengdu dialect) because the poem is about a great person who once lived in the area, and the poet also lived there. But for authenticity, I searched up some stuff on the net and tried to recreate older versions of Chengdu dialect, which has evolved rapidly over the past century, so this is quite a bit different from the dialect actually spoken in Chengdu nowadays...... Apologize beforehand to any PLs out there :oops:

The title is shu xiang(third tone on shu and fourth tone on xiang) or 蜀相, the characters are the same in simplified and traditional. The author is 杜甫, du fu (fourth tone on du and third tone on fu). I think there isn't an official romanization system for my dialect as of now, so I will stick with pinyin.

Source:http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/52323/pg52323-images.html
Do I need to provide any information other than that?

Thank you for your work!
Guomin
Thanks, Guomin! That's quite an original contribution, reading it in a historical version of the Chengdu dialect! I think that's very cool. I wonder how we should classify it. :hmm: The text is Classical Chinese, so "Chinese" still seem appropriate. Of all the different forms of Chinese, we have a separate entry on the LV language list only for Cantonese. Not sure if there's a system behind this...

I wonder if Yuqing is up to PLing this? I'm not sure I could handle it... :help:

I didn't write out the tones. I'm not sure if the tones in the Chengdu dialect should be marked using the same diacritics as in Mandarin, and, in any case, marking the tones doesn't seem like a big deal, since we have the Chinese characters there.

Just a couple of minor points. The first may sound familiar. Please list a few keywords for us. :)

The other point is that always we use the main Gutenberg book page, like the one below, so if you could list it for us instead of a particular version of the book, it would save us a few moments tracking it down. :)

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/52323

Michael

Liber
Posts: 71
Joined: May 26th, 2020, 5:50 am

Post by Liber » June 24th, 2020, 4:37 pm

Kazbek wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 3:36 pm
Liber wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 11:16 am
Obviously, there is much to improve :-) Sbagliando si impara (hopefully) :-)
I find that working to improve my reading and speaking in general is one of my favorite things about LV, but I can't claim to be as much of a perfectionist as you seem to be! :D
Thank you for your encouragement :D
MW updated. I'm assuming the length is unchanged?

Michael
The length is now 1:52 :mrgreen:

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 4:38 pm

Liber wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 2:22 pm
With Catullus CI always goes Foscolo's sonnet.

The year is on page 10: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n9/mode/2up , and 531: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n531/mode/2up ; but note anomalies at page 533: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n533/mode/2up . Probably it was a copy of the 1825 republished later, in the '40s. There was a price in Italy and one in Austria!!!

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

In morte del fratello Giovanni di Ugo Foscolo (1778–1827)
Text URL: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n383/mode/2up?q=fratel
Duration: 1:26
MP3 URL: https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_mortefratello_foscolo_le_128kb.mp3
Link to author on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ugo_Foscolo
Key Words: multilingual, italian, catullus, foscolo, poetry, sonnet, death, grief, burial, funeral rites, exile
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Thank you for your time.
Liber
Thank you, Liber! I've been PLing a novel of his, but I'm not very familiar with his poetry. Will check out after the project is complete. :)

Michael

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 4:40 pm

Liber wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 4:37 pm
The length is now 1:52 :mrgreen:
Thanks! Fixes may result in small differences in duration, but recording them in the MW might potentially help the MC to spot a misplaced upload during cataloging.

Michael

Guomin
Posts: 36
Joined: June 20th, 2020, 11:30 am

Post by Guomin » June 24th, 2020, 4:44 pm

Hello,Michael
I love the suggestion to put the solo here, but as I just did my first recording, I am afraid that the whole thing with all 12 chapters is going to be more than 72 minutes. My first recording is probably going to be more than 10 min after the edits, and the other chapters aren't going to be much shorter.

The second short work definitely could and should be included in the Chinese section as Southwestern Mandarin, as the name suggests, is a dialect of Mandarin, thus still very much Chinese.

I also saw that there are a lot of poems read in Hokkien and Teochow in the Chinese audiobook section, so maybe with some help, they can be sorted out and given respective entries, as the two varieties of Chinese are as different as Cantonese and Mandarin, if not more, they could basically be seen as different languages; or would it be practical to set up a big section called Chinese with all of them in it, and have sub-sections with the various dialects and varieties? I wonder.

And, yes, I figured that it is a good idea to not mark the tones, as there are some inconsistencies. But if you want, there are two ways to mark them: 蜀相 shu2 siang4 or 蜀相 shu21 siang213 , the first is based on the tones they correspond to in Mandarin, and the second is based on the relative height of the tone contours. But it doesn't look great, so probably not.

Keywords: admiration, three kingdoms, regret, praise, lament, expectations

New source page here:https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/52323

Thank you!
Guomin

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 5:03 pm

Guomin wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 4:44 pm
Hello,Michael
I love the suggestion to put the solo here, but as I just did my first recording, I am afraid that the whole thing with all 12 chapters is going to be more than 72 minutes. My first recording is probably going to be more than 10 min after the edits, and the other chapters aren't going to be much shorter.

The second short work definitely could and should be included in the Chinese section as Southwestern Mandarin, as the name suggests, is a dialect of Mandarin, thus still very much Chinese.
Sounds good!
I also saw that there are a lot of poems read in Hokkien and Teochow in the Chinese audiobook section, so maybe with some help, they can be sorted out and given respective entries, as the two varieties of Chinese are as different as Cantonese and Mandarin, if not more, they could basically be seen as different languages; or would it be practical to set up a big section called Chinese with all of them in it, and have sub-sections with the various dialects and varieties? I wonder.
Yes, I wonder too. The texts are all in Classical Chinese, but they are read in very different ways. Perhaps these cases should all be classified under Chinese, on analogy with regional accents of other languages, and we should keep separate Chinese language codes for texts that transcribe spoken forms of the dialects rather readings of classical texts...
And, yes, I figured that it is a good idea to not mark the tones, as there are some inconsistencies. But if you want, there are two ways to mark them: 蜀相 shu2 siang4 or 蜀相 shu21 siang213 , the first is based on the tones they correspond to in Mandarin, and the second is based on the relative height of the tone contours. But it doesn't look great, so probably not.
Thanks for the info, but I would say it's better to leave the tones out. The search engine can handle Latin/pinyin diacritics, but I don't think it will be able to figure out that "shu" is the same word as "shu2".
Keywords: admiration, three kingdoms, regret, praise, lament, expectations

New source page here:https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/52323

Thank you!
Guomin
Thanks, Guomin!
Michael

Guomin
Posts: 36
Joined: June 20th, 2020, 11:30 am

Post by Guomin » June 24th, 2020, 5:24 pm

Hello,Michael

If as you said, dialects and accents of other languages are put into one big section, then I don't see much reason for Chinese to not stick with the same standard, and the various dialects of Mandarin and varieties of Chinese can be organized under that big "folder".

Also, would you mind also putting Chengdu as a keyword? That the poem is about Chengdu is one of the main reasons I used the Chengdu dialect.

Thank you,
Guomin

Kazbek
Posts: 1063
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » June 24th, 2020, 5:32 pm

Guomin wrote:
June 24th, 2020, 5:24 pm

Also, would you mind also putting Chengdu as a keyword? That the poem is about Chengdu is one of the main reasons I used the Chengdu dialect.
Done!

Michael

Liber
Posts: 71
Joined: May 26th, 2020, 5:50 am

Post by Liber » June 24th, 2020, 6:29 pm

And this is a sibling of the other sonnet by Foscolo :-)

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Alla sera di Ugo Foscolo (1778–1827)
Text URL: https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_q4RT8OYo-LEC/page/n384/mode/2up
Duration: 1:33
MP3 URL: https://librivox.org/uploads/toddhw/msw025_allasera_foscolo_le_128kb.mp3
Link to author on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ugo_Foscolo
Key Words: multilingual, italian, foscolo, poetry, sonnet, evening, darkness, death, peace, time, restlessness, war, patriotism
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

One cannot stay without the other :-)

Thank you for your time.
Liber

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