Do PLer's receive credit in the catalogue? Should they?

[Arnieh]

In looking at the catalogue I've noticed that in projects with a DPL, the proof listenters name is listed. But in projects that don't have a DPL, and many multi-reader works, the PLers for each chapter do not receive credit for their efforts. I haven't PL'ed any sections yet but if I did, especially long chapters, I'd like to think I'd be recognized for it.

[TriciaG]

It's too much work for the MC to document and list all the one-off PL's who only do one or two chapters in a large project. It isn't built into the system, so it would all have to be done by hand.

If you want credit, become a DPL.

[RuthieG]

There are quite a few things here that you don't get a visible credit for - many a lot more time-consuming that PLing a chapter of a book. Think of it as pro salute animae...

Ruth

[annise]

You are recognised, by the people who count. Your fellow LibriVoxers
Your are recognised as someone who is prepared to step in and help out another reader so the books can be finished and released.

Anne

[ekzemplaro]

Hello Arnie san,

I agree with your opinion.
PLer's should receive credit in the catalogue.

I haven't PL'ed any sections yet but if I did, especially long chapters, I'd like to think I'd be recognized for it.

I've been PLed by lots of people. I really wish to give credit to them.

Even though we can't do now, we need to express our requirement to improve LibriVox System. If you are silent, developers don't know your requirement.

Cheers,
Masa

[enko]

Yes, proof listeners should receive credit in the catalogue. An appropriate way of doing that could be found.

[RuthieG]

I write this with admin insight, but with my admin hat OFF.

DPLs have a written credit on a book catalogue page because they have committed to seeing the project through to the end, as do the BC and MC, and they are added to the database so that they can add their notes to the MW. It is not desirable to add many extra fields in the database for the (uncommon) occurrence of occasional proof-listeners. (Masa san, yes, I know that the Multilingual Short Works is unique, as it is unlikely that one person could PL all sections.) So what you are asking is for MCs to add them to the catalogue page manually.

You might just as well say that those dealing with the mountains of emails that come to LibriVox in various ways, or who spend hours a week helping new readers with their audio quality, or who deal with errors post-cataloguing, or edit chapters where the reader has disappeared before doing their edits, or spend countless hours on testing new software, should ALL have some kind of visible recognition (and I could give you dozens more examples). We don't expect, or want, to be credited for all the things that we do for the good of LibriVox. That's not what it is about.

So, in a nutshell, I disagree. Other opinions may, of course, vary.

Ruth

[annise]

Masa - there would be nothing to stop you or any other BC listing the PLers in the summary - and it would then show in the summary as happens with the cast lists for plays.
However - I think the BC , particularly of a multilingual project has quite enough to do already - they are the most difficult projects to run well and I would never recommend any additions to the present workload for something that is not essential to the project.

Anne

[ekzemplaro]

Bonjour enko san,

Thank you for your message.

An appropriate way of doing that could be found.

Solution is not difficult. Especially when we're planning to reconstruct the system.
One solution,
1) A proof listener login.
2) If the recording is OK. The proof listener push the OK button.
3) Responding to the button push, the system change the status of the section from
'PL needed' to 'PL OK' and insert the name of the proof listener into database.

This is not a special technology. Using jQuery library it's a chore.

But once system is completed, it will be difficult to change the system.

Ruth san,

So what you are asking is for MCs to add them to the catalogue page manually.

Thank you for your message.
Why don't we utilize IT technology?
If we utilize open source method, it will be easily accomplished.

Anne san,

I would never recommend any additions to the present workload for something

I perfectly agree with you.
There must be a Win Win solution.
I mean Credit are given and workload is reduced.

I've been thinking, why I manually change from 'red' to 'green' & 'Needed' to 'OK'.
This kind should be a button operaiton.

Cheers,
Masa

[carolb]

You might just as well say that those dealing with the mountains of emails that come to LibriVox in various ways, or who spend hours a week helping new readers with their audio quality, or who deal with errors post-cataloguing, or edit chapters where the reader has disappeared before doing their edits, or spend countless hours on testing new software, should ALL have some kind of visible recognition (and I could give you dozens more examples).
We don't expect, or want, to be credited for all the things that we do for the good of LibriVox. That's not what it is about. Ruth

Hear, hear, Ruth! They have been my thoughts as I read the previous posts in this thread.

I can't claim to have vast experience in PLing, but the few projects I have listened to have been read because I was interested in the subject matter, and not for the glory of having my name associated with the project. I can't speak for others, but it seems to me that if people have a need to see their listenings acknowledged in a 'what's-in-it-for-me' way, (hardly a Librivox attitude, sadly) then DPL is the way to go - or recording.

Carol

[RuthieG]

The new system has been in development for many months and is now at an advanced stage. Adding occasional proof-listeners to the catalogue pages has never been suggested before, and I have never previously heard of an occasional proof-listener who thought it remotely important. Our budget is very limited. If this involves major changes, we will not have the resources to do it, but I will make your views known.

Ruth

[Arnieh]

I agree with Masa San and Enko . And I must say it is not a question of "glory seeking", for what glory is there to be had at LibriVox? No, it is rather a question of respect, recognition, and most importantly honor. Isn't LibriVox a collaborative community effort? Should we not find a way to honor every one who contributes? It would appear that proof listening is an important part of the quality control process here at LibriVox, I've also noticed many works that have no DPL and/or must rely on individuals stepping forth, unselfishly, to help PL a work together. Now, if we already give credit to every individual reader of a chapter, in every book, should PLer's not receive the same recognition and respect as that of the readers? I've not done any PLing, but I can imagine it can sometimes be a very labor intensive task, probably having to rewind recordings and attempting to synch the reading with the written words. It seems to me we do these volunteers a great dishonor by not giving them the recognition they deserve.

Yes it might mean some extra work, but I believe that where there is a will there is a way. Let us find it.

[carolb]

I've not done any PLing, but I can imagine...

May I respectfully suggest that you try proof listening for yourself, in order to gain a better understanding of the workings of Librivox?

Here is the link to 4 very helpful proof-listening instruction videos, made by Phil,
just one of our unsung admin heroes who work tirelessly and uncredited behind the scenes for us.

These are the people who deserve most credit.

Carol

[Tlaloc]

Yes, LV is a collaborative community. What does this mean? Everyone here participates as a volunteer. To achieve what? Record books and offer them for nothing, to anyone who is making the effort to listen to them.
As volunteers, we all commit to strive in the same direction: Producing those audiobooks, which implies a great number of tasks, as reading, recording, researching, fixing all kind of problems (technical, legal, organisational, receiving new volunteers and analysing their first recording, the same repetitive tasks to be done and done again, etc etc.). Everyone takes his part in this chain of tasks and pl is one of those. To be a part of this chain implies intrinsically that you are loyally respected, recognised and honoured by your fellow Librivoxers and listeners who are aware, that you are adding something precious to their lives.
So, no crediting, no debiting - we are not a banking institution - and surely, no dishonour.
Let’s just stick to what is essential in this project, it’s already a huge amount of work for everybody and particularly for the volunteering admins.
Herman

[Cori]

Well put, Herman. I agree completely.