Help for a new PL about pronunciation

Post your questions & get help from friendly LibriVoxers
JorWat
Posts: 1314
Joined: February 16th, 2009, 10:20 am
Location: Oxfordshire, England

Post by JorWat » September 3rd, 2016, 6:05 am

I'm currently the DPL for Jane Austen and Her Times, and there was just a post saying that my "PL comments are much more extensive that what [they] expected for the Standard PL level".

I suspect this is due to a lot of my comments being about pronunciation of French words.

My question is what's the correct thing to do? I feel that if someone was reading a book with the word 'hyperbole', and said 'hyper bowl', it should be pointed out. So is it also wrong to point out 'coquelicot' is pronounced 'COKE-lee-koh', and not 'co-QUIL-eh-cot', or 'fichu' is pronounced 'FEE-shu', and not 'fi-KYU'?
Last edited by JorWat on September 3rd, 2016, 6:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
Jordan

Alcohol and Maths don't mix. So never drink and derive.

TriciaG
LibriVox Admin Team
Posts: 46284
Joined: June 15th, 2008, 10:30 pm
Location: Toronto, ON (but Minnesotan to age 32)

Post by TriciaG » September 3rd, 2016, 6:21 am

Glad you asked! From our PL Guidelines:
There are some standard things that need to be listened for in each section, with possible additions depending on the nature of the text. The first post of each proof-listening thread should include a list of the requirements; if it doesn't, please ask the BC or soloist. By far the most common level of PL required is 'standard PL':
-- Do the intro and disclaimer match the instructions in the first post of the project thread?
-- Are there any long silences or pauses that ought to be edited out? If so, note the time.
-- Are there any repeats, or serious stumbles that ought to be edited out? If so, note the words and the time.
-- Is there excessive background noise, a constant hiss or buzz that detracts from the reading?
-- Did you need to turn your volume up unusually high to listen to the recording? (Or did you find the recording too loud?)
-- Are the correct closing words used at the end of the recording, as per the first post of the project thread?
-- Are there 5 seconds of silence (10 if the recording is more than 30 minutes long) at the end of the file?

See other levels of PL further down.

For what type of thing should I NOT be listening?
Text content, reading style, speed, pronunciation, or accents. The LibriVox community values a wide variety of reading styles; what one person finds difficult to hear, another person may really enjoy. The interpretation of the reader is not for our proof-listeners to judge. If you are uncomfortable listening to a particular voice, feel free to return the section to the pool for another proof-listener to claim. Please also see the LibriVox policy on feedback. If you are unsure about giving feedback on a specific section, contact a member of the LibriVox admin team privately first.
You might be interested in taking our Prooflistening quiz for your enjoyment and growth. :D
Hatfields & McCoys Sensationalist Account: An American Vendetta
Humor: Maxims of Methuselah about women

JorWat
Posts: 1314
Joined: February 16th, 2009, 10:20 am
Location: Oxfordshire, England

Post by JorWat » September 3rd, 2016, 6:37 am

You didn't really answer my question. I sort of assumed when it said to not listen for pronunciation, it meant things like regional pronunciation, or small stumbles. Surely completely mispronouncing a word should be pointed out?

What's the limit? If someone read 'pterodactyl' as 'peter-odd-ace-tile' would it be wrong to point that out? Because I feel some of the pronunciations I mentioned were almost as 'wrong' as that.
Jordan

Alcohol and Maths don't mix. So never drink and derive.

TriciaG
LibriVox Admin Team
Posts: 46284
Joined: June 15th, 2008, 10:30 pm
Location: Toronto, ON (but Minnesotan to age 32)

Post by TriciaG » September 3rd, 2016, 6:54 am

Historically and by policy, we're not supposed to point out any mispronunciations. However, I will confess that I do point them out sometimes, but I make sure to not say they have to be fixed in the recording. So I'll list my standard PL items, then say something like, "And for your information in further recordings, 'gaol' is pronounced 'jail'."

A reader may ask for pronunciation pointers, or you may know from previous experience with the reader that he/she is one that would like all such things pointed out. In those cases, go for it. But if the PL is "standard" and there are no indications from the reader, then pronunciation is not one of the things to listen for.
Hatfields & McCoys Sensationalist Account: An American Vendetta
Humor: Maxims of Methuselah about women

JorWat
Posts: 1314
Joined: February 16th, 2009, 10:20 am
Location: Oxfordshire, England

Post by JorWat » September 3rd, 2016, 7:12 am

Alright, thanks for the help.

As much as it pains me, I will ignore pronunciation...
Jordan

Alcohol and Maths don't mix. So never drink and derive.

Darvinia
LibriVox Admin Team
Posts: 3114
Joined: March 15th, 2009, 8:38 pm
Location: Alberta, Canada

Post by Darvinia » September 3rd, 2016, 8:35 am

After listing standard PL notes you could say something like:
"I noticed some mispronounced French words. You aren't required to but if you would like to fix those too I can give you the time stamps."

After all, the reader likely thought they were correct and may appreciate the information.
Bev

"I yam what I yam, and that's all what I yam." - Popeye, the sailor man
"Everybody's got a mountain to climb" - Dickey Betts
12696

JorWat
Posts: 1314
Joined: February 16th, 2009, 10:20 am
Location: Oxfordshire, England

Post by JorWat » September 3rd, 2016, 9:04 am

Darvinia wrote:After listing standard PL notes you could say something like:
"I noticed some mispronounced French words. You aren't required to but if you would like to fix those too I can give you the time stamps."

After all, the reader likely thought they were correct and may appreciate the information.
Yeah, I might do that.
Jordan

Alcohol and Maths don't mix. So never drink and derive.

Monaxi
Posts: 1037
Joined: April 30th, 2013, 7:34 pm

Post by Monaxi » September 10th, 2016, 6:54 pm

I'm also new to PLing, and I've found that I've been interpreting the 5 (or 10) seconds of silence at the end of recordings somewhat differently than other readers. I've always deleted/silenced the last 5 (or 10) seconds of sound. I'm finding that other readers merely let their recording continue for 5 (or 10) seconds after they've finished reading.

Is this an important distinction? Does it matter to the volume readings? Thank you!

(As for pronunciations, I have to laugh after I realize that I've been pronouncing a word incorrectly for years, when I suddenly hear another LV reader say it correctly. Really I'm not sure if I'm more of a LV reader or listener :hmm: )
Peace be with you,
Sister

annise
LibriVox Admin Team
Posts: 32936
Joined: April 3rd, 2008, 3:55 am
Location: Melbourne,Australia

Post by annise » September 10th, 2016, 7:20 pm

It's better to leave it run - not enough for your earlier ones to need changing but it's better just to treat it as part of the recording and use any noise cleaning and processing using the whole file. 2 reasons I can think of
I'ts a good noise sample if you need to noise clean later
Depending on the difference between total silence and background noise in your recording , total silence may have the listener wondering if the battery has gone flat. :D

Anne

TriciaG
LibriVox Admin Team
Posts: 46284
Joined: June 15th, 2008, 10:30 pm
Location: Toronto, ON (but Minnesotan to age 32)

Post by TriciaG » September 11th, 2016, 5:01 am

It doesn't matter to the recording's overall volume, if that is what you're asking. In my opinion, it doesn't really matter which way you do it, except that when you let the recording run on to the end, then the end silence is great for getting your noise profile for noise removal. As a listener, I've never been bothered by dead silence at the end. I may notice it if there's a lot of background noise in the recording, but it doesn't bother me. :)
Hatfields & McCoys Sensationalist Account: An American Vendetta
Humor: Maxims of Methuselah about women

Monaxi
Posts: 1037
Joined: April 30th, 2013, 7:34 pm

Post by Monaxi » September 11th, 2016, 1:49 pm

Noise removal is my very first editing step, and I use the first 5 seconds of the recording, before deleting it. I can't imagine listening to all that racket while editing the text/reading.
Peace be with you,
Sister

TriciaG
LibriVox Admin Team
Posts: 46284
Joined: June 15th, 2008, 10:30 pm
Location: Toronto, ON (but Minnesotan to age 32)

Post by TriciaG » September 11th, 2016, 5:04 pm

I think that's fine, then. :) As a PL, as long as the background noise is acceptable in the recording, there doesn't need to be any in the end silence. :lol:
Hatfields & McCoys Sensationalist Account: An American Vendetta
Humor: Maxims of Methuselah about women

sjmarky
Posts: 2633
Joined: August 28th, 2006, 8:47 pm
Location: Poictesme
Contact:

Post by sjmarky » September 11th, 2016, 7:19 pm

JorWat wrote:I'm currently the DPL for Jane Austen and Her Times, and there was just a post saying that my "PL comments are much more extensive that what [they] expected for the Standard PL level".

I suspect this is due to a lot of my comments being about pronunciation of French words.

My question is what's the correct thing to do? I feel that if someone was reading a book with the word 'hyperbole', and said 'hyper bowl', it should be pointed out. So is it also wrong to point out 'coquelicot' is pronounced 'COKE-lee-koh', and not 'co-QUIL-eh-cot', or 'fichu' is pronounced 'FEE-shu', and not 'fi-KYU'?
I think there's a difference between PLing a group project and a solo. If you were DPLing one of my solo recordings I would welcome catching mispronunciations. This may not be so welcome in a group project, as I noted from the reader comments. Just my opinion. You could PL one of my projects any time.
"Bringing you yesterday's tomorrow...today!"

My website
My Librivox reader page

StoryTeller
Posts: 82
Joined: October 23rd, 2015, 9:07 pm
Contact:

Post by StoryTeller » September 12th, 2016, 12:14 am

:thumbs: What sjmarky said. Please DPL me anytime! I love what you do.
~ Georgina ~

MaryinArkansas
Posts: 875
Joined: October 4th, 2008, 8:06 pm
Location: Arkansas

Post by MaryinArkansas » September 13th, 2016, 3:27 pm

If I make a mistake in pronouncing a word I appreciate it when a proof listener points out my mistake. It would be embarrassing to me to say a word incorrectly in public because nobody ever pointed out my error. I don't expect proof listeners to make me a perfect reader, but I appreciate it when they try to make my reading better.
Mary

"Reading is an act of civilization; it’s one of the greatest acts of civilization because it takes the free raw material of the mind and builds castles of possibilities.” Ben Okri

Marsupial's Books

Post Reply