Pronunciation help: all languages

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GraceBuchanan
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Post by GraceBuchanan » April 5th, 2020, 7:12 am

schrm wrote:
April 5th, 2020, 5:44 am
hi grace,

oh, when rapunzelina is dpl, i'm sure everything will be ok and understandable!
(that is what i learned thelast days: in the end, you are recording for an english speaking audience as an english speaking reader and it may even ease the flow of reading and listening, when you speak it in our way! and on the other hand, most of english readers pronounce german words better than we are able to speak english :-) )
Thank you for your kind message!

Yes, Rapunzelina is super supportive! Good point about recording for an English-speaking audience. I would like the words to be intelligible to someone who is familiar with them, but, like you wrote, it really isn't necessary since the text is written for people who don't speak those languages. Besides, I have heard varying pronunciations of common medical terms among people in the profession, so I must be excused for irregular pronunciation of these uncommon words.
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acarlow
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Post by acarlow » May 11th, 2020, 9:17 pm

Help with Greek, please!

In the second paragraph of page 260 of this text: https://archive.org/details/cu31924023187465/page/n297/mode/1up is a sentence in what I believe to be Greek. I am hoping that someone here could somehow provide the pronunciation of the sentence so that I could then record it for our project: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=78960 (Cambridge Modern History, vol. 1).

Thank you!

Kazbek
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Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » May 11th, 2020, 9:54 pm

acarlow wrote:
May 11th, 2020, 9:17 pm
Help with Greek, please!

In the second paragraph of page 260 of this text: https://archive.org/details/cu31924023187465/page/n297/mode/1up is a sentence in what I believe to be Greek. I am hoping that someone here could somehow provide the pronunciation of the sentence so that I could then record it for our project: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=78960 (Cambridge Modern History, vol. 1).

Thank you!
Two options:

1) Read it in Erasmian classical Greek pronunciation as eh-MAYS DOO-loy THE-loh-men EY-nai too bah-see-LAY-os tohn roh-MAI-on kai oo-HEE soo, with "THE" as in "thespian", and "ai" as in "my"

2) Read it in modern Greek pronunciation, which would be closer to the Byzantine Greek of that time: ee-MEES THOO-lee THE-loh-men EE-nay too vah-see-LAY-os ton roh-MAY-on kay oo-HEE soo, with the TH in THOO voiced as in "that" and the other voiceless as before.

It means "we want to be slaves of the king of the Romans (i.e., Byzantine emperor) and not yours".

Either way, I wouldn't worry about it too much. :)

Michael

Kazbek
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Post by Kazbek » May 19th, 2020, 4:55 pm

Any Kölsch speakers around here? I could use some pronunciation tips for a text written in Cologne around 1500 (so, probably with antiquated orthography). I can make sense of most of it, but I'm not entirely sure what sounds some of the letters represent.

https://archive.org/details/epidemicsofmiddl00unse/page/156/mode/1up

Michael

tovarisch
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Post by tovarisch » May 20th, 2020, 7:46 am

Two notes, Michael.

One, if you are not entirely sure, there is probably not enough people in the world (among our listeners) who would, either. Give it your best shot and move on.

Two, on the page 156, the link to which you posted, which line/paragraph are you referring to? Or is it the entire page?

Those are general notes. I am not proficient enough in Koelsch to provide any specific assistance. Sorry.
tovarisch
  • reality prompts me to scale down my reading, sorry to say
    to PLers: do correct my pronunciation please

KevinS
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Post by KevinS » May 20th, 2020, 10:31 am

Kazbek wrote:
May 19th, 2020, 4:55 pm
Any Kölsch speakers around here?
Beer? Now you're talkin'!
What? What's that? Why are you shouting?

schrm
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Location: Austria

Post by schrm » May 20th, 2020, 1:00 pm

Kazbek wrote:
May 19th, 2020, 4:55 pm
Any Kölsch speakers around here? I could use some pronunciation tips for a text written in Cologne around 1500 (so, probably with antiquated orthography). I can make sense of most of it, but I'm not entirely sure what sounds some of the letters represent.

https://archive.org/details/epidemicsofmiddl00unse/page/156/mode/1up

Michael
that was really long ago, as a not-cologne german speaker i have to pass here..
won't be of much help.
so i just could read it for you, and it wouldn't even be near the original pronounciation..

/reader/12275
cc welcome! my skills improve from pl notes that cite when my english pronunciation is way off, or when words are missing.
thx!


en: lay down your arms, essays on art by goethe

de: sammlung prosa, rousseau, hoffmann: sommerfrische

Kazbek
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Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » May 20th, 2020, 3:09 pm

schrm wrote:
May 20th, 2020, 1:00 pm

that was really long ago, as a not-cologne german speaker i have to pass here..
won't be of much help.
so i just could read it for you, and it wouldn't even be near the original pronounciation..
Thanks for the offer! It's for a solo project, but if you'd like to record it, I'll use your pronunciation for inspiration. My goal isn't to be historically accurate, but rather to make the text vaguely intelligible to listeners who know German. And if someone from Cologne hears it, hopefully give them a good laugh. :)

Michael

schrm
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Location: Austria

Post by schrm » May 21st, 2020, 3:40 am

Kazbek wrote:
May 20th, 2020, 3:09 pm
schrm wrote:
May 20th, 2020, 1:00 pm

that was really long ago, as a not-cologne german speaker i have to pass here..
won't be of much help.
so i just could read it for you, and it wouldn't even be near the original pronounciation..
Thanks for the offer! It's for a solo project, but if you'd like to record it, I'll use your pronunciation for inspiration. My goal isn't to be historically accurate, but rather to make the text vaguely intelligible to listeners who know German. And if someone from Cologne hears it, hopefully give them a good laugh. :)

Michael
ok, since you are aware of the problems :-D

i will try to upload in a few hours into the tests folder, will post the link here

/reader/12275
cc welcome! my skills improve from pl notes that cite when my english pronunciation is way off, or when words are missing.
thx!


en: lay down your arms, essays on art by goethe

de: sammlung prosa, rousseau, hoffmann: sommerfrische

schrm
Posts: 2964
Joined: February 10th, 2018, 11:02 am
Location: Austria

Post by schrm » May 21st, 2020, 6:03 am

Kazbek wrote:
May 20th, 2020, 3:09 pm
schrm wrote:
May 20th, 2020, 1:00 pm

that was really long ago, as a not-cologne german speaker i have to pass here..
won't be of much help.
so i just could read it for you, and it wouldn't even be near the original pronounciation..
Thanks for the offer! It's for a solo project, but if you'd like to record it, I'll use your pronunciation for inspiration. My goal isn't to be historically accurate, but rather to make the text vaguely intelligible to listeners who know German. And if someone from Cologne hears it, hopefully give them a good laugh. :)

Michael
hi michael,

https://librivox.org/uploads/tests/katzbecks_mittelhochdeutsch.mp3
Track Length
2:55,07 (m:ss.ss)

my try..
just a little bit of editing, im sorry for every mouthnoise etc

this recording is in the public domain - you can delete it, also :-D

i hope i have time to choose one of the italien poetesse poems and read it, sometimes..

cheers,

edit: i know now, what you couldn't figure out:
he uses v as u, y as i, sometimes ae is ä, sometimes rather a_e
i know some of this problems with reading from grimms fairytales and my own projects - but that is difficult in dialect..
quite confusing!

/reader/12275
cc welcome! my skills improve from pl notes that cite when my english pronunciation is way off, or when words are missing.
thx!


en: lay down your arms, essays on art by goethe

de: sammlung prosa, rousseau, hoffmann: sommerfrische

Kazbek
Posts: 1585
Joined: April 24th, 2019, 12:06 pm

Post by Kazbek » May 21st, 2020, 6:39 am

Great. Many thanks!

Michael

paulfwb
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Post by paulfwb » June 1st, 2020, 10:15 am

Hello,
First, generally accent does not matter, however it would be great if there was some accent tag for each recording.
I'm personally fascinated in hearing readings close to the accent of the author.
For example, I would prefer to hear War and Peace read in the accent, even in English, by someone with the accent of what was the "Tula Governorate" region than a Lincolnshire accent.

This would make life easier for finding a reading.

Is there such information available?

I'd be grateful for any hints.
Paul

(I have heard that the accent of William Shakespeare was close to that spoken today in parts of the Appalachian Mountains and not that of Alan Rickman)

Lynnet
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Post by Lynnet » June 1st, 2020, 10:31 am

As readers can read what they wish, we cannot control (nor would wish to) what readers' accents are. Our standard is "understood by a native speaker". Some readers choose to approximate accurate accents, but others are not comfortable 'faking it'. Trial and error will tell you which readers you enjoy listening to.
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KevinS
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Post by KevinS » June 1st, 2020, 11:27 am

paulfwb wrote:
June 1st, 2020, 10:15 am
Hello,
First, generally accent does not matter, however it would be great if there was some accent tag for each recording.
I'm personally fascinated in hearing readings close to the accent of the author.
For example, I would prefer to hear War and Peace read in the accent, even in English, by someone with the accent of what was the "Tula Governorate" region than a Lincolnshire accent.

This would make life easier for finding a reading.

Is there such information available?

I'd be grateful for any hints.
Paul

(I have heard that the accent of William Shakespeare was close to that spoken today in parts of the Appalachian Mountains and not that of Alan Rickman)
One's accent, whether native or acquired, could be entered by the reader into his or her section for tags, but that could only be done for solo projects (I imagine.) Our problem is that the tags are not yet available to the search engine (if I understand matters as they are now.) I think, too, that people are a bit reluctant to identify their accents; not because they are shy or unwilling, but they just don't know. My accent, for instance, can only be identified as 'American, and rather boring.'
What? What's that? Why are you shouting?

schrm
Posts: 2964
Joined: February 10th, 2018, 11:02 am
Location: Austria

Post by schrm » June 1st, 2020, 12:14 pm

in austrias mountain areas and all over germany, switzerland, and neighbour countries are really big differences between dialects and melody of the speaking.
one effect is, that some people might not be able to understand someone speaking totally natural german, another effect is we are using that as a weapon to diminuish others (dialects).
and the third effect is, that some people think, you are not speaking the dialect of your born into hometown, or of your village of choice, of the valley where your family comes from, or whatever... wether they are able to analyse it, or not.

so, from my point of view: don't start the dialect wars, please.

/reader/12275
cc welcome! my skills improve from pl notes that cite when my english pronunciation is way off, or when words are missing.
thx!


en: lay down your arms, essays on art by goethe

de: sammlung prosa, rousseau, hoffmann: sommerfrische

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